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hey this is john plans because they

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might be giants and you're listening to

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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

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episode number

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238 for the 12th of may 2013 richard

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saunders here with you from sydney

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australia

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and yes later on in the show maynard

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interviews john flansberg from they

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might be giants they might be giants now

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this is a group

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i know many of you are fans of they

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might be giants this is a group who

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strongly support science and later in

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the show we'll find out more with

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maynard's spooky action good on you they

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might be giants and after that interview

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we'll play the song from they might be

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giants science is real that's all coming

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up later in the show to kick off the

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show to kick off the show one of the

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best one of the best dr rachie reports i

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think we've ever had

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it's just

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richie discusses the latest goings-on

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with the avn as she normally does but

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this one is particularly good

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that's particularly good we're going to

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play clips from the floor of the new

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south wales parliament to see what the

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politicians from both sides of the house

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let's find out what they have to say

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about the australian vaccination network

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and maybe you can use this uh episode of

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the skeptic zone this dr raichi reports

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and play it to your local

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politician no matter where you are in

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the world this is what we're doing in

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australia

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let your local politicians know

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anyway i think you're going to really

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enjoy

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this dr richie reports

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and of course coming up a bit later in

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this week's show a week in science with

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our good friend dr paul willis from the

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royal institution of australia that's

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so much to get through on this week's

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show but before we get into the episode

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a little personal note from me

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when i was uh

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in the czech republic just recently at

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the wonderful

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um afo festival film festival in olomots

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i was doing lots of origami and i was

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doing a workshop and this

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this uh wonderful lady came up and

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thanked me very much and told me that

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she came from um

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sort of a school for special needs uh

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children in prague

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that's quite quite interested to hear

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this so i gave her one of my dvds

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origami dvd with the

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how to make origami models and she was

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so

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myself wow that's really great and um

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you know it's nice to think that maybe

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the

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and it's just reminded me that yes

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i've got this dvd i made with my good

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friend gary clark who also makes origami

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it's called

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dvd origami it's still on sale if you'd

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like to buy a copy there are 20 models

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all step by step over two hours of

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instructions and you can make dinosaurs

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and boats and horses and hats and birds

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and all sorts of things

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if you're interested please visit

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www.maximedia that's m a x

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i

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slash

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dvd hyphen

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origami

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media or something like that anyway if

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you enjoy origami i think you'll enjoy

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that uh

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that dvd

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but for now let's get into this week's

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now it's time for dr rachie reports with

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hello listeners and welcome to dr reggie

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reports

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well some of you may have seen my talk

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at qed recently in manchester and before

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i get into this week's report i want to

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say thanks to everyone who i met at qed

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and especially to the organizers so

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accurately i did talk about the efforts

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by australian skeptics and also

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just a bunch of ruffians if you like

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known as stop the australian vaccination

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network or savn

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and how our work or grassroots

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campaigning has affected the reputation

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of the australian vaccination network

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well in the last week or so i was

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extremely surprised and very pleased to

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see one of our local newspapers

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put forth a campaign called no jab no

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play this is murdoch run press and they

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decided to dedicate a whole week to

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exposing the dangers of the

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anti-vaccination movement and calling on

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the government to bring in legislation

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to ban unvaccinated children from

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attending child care

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and also to close the loophole that

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allows parents who don't vaccinate to

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still receive the family tax benefit

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associated with completing the childhood

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immunisation schedule

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now of course as you can imagine the

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anti-vaxxer's heads exploded at this

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because it was a week of relentless

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campaigning by the murdoch press

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of course the usual canads were rolled

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out including things such as murdoch has

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somehow a link to big pharma or is

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sponsored by pfizer

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as well as the standard sort of it's a

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conspiracy and this is suppressing our

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human rights and freedom of speech etc

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etc

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but the situation in australia now is

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becoming a bit like a vacuum

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the anti-vaxxers are still screeching

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but nobody's listening anymore it's now

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become the media focusing on how this

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impacts on the community as opposed to

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this is my rights as a parent

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now it's important to note that of

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course exemptions for people that have

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medical conditions or have had adverse

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events previously to vaccinations or

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have some sort of allergy to

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vaccinations would obviously be exempt

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from having to get vaccinations if they

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go into child care the campaign was

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simply designed to close the loophole

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for parents who don't have a valid

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reason except that they just don't like

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it

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so if you didn't think this was bad

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enough the avn has also been copying an

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absolute bollocking in new south wales

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parliament in the last two weeks

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this is off the back of changes to

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legislation

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for the public health act which i

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touched on when i was in qed

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and that is to close some loopholes that

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were exposed in the act when the avn

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sued the new south wales healthcare

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complaints commission back in 2010

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now this legal action was on the back of

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the hcc investigating the australian

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vaccination network and determining that

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they posed a risk to consumers their

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information was misleading it was purely

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anti-vaccination and the consumers

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should not use it as medical advice now

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the avn claimed that the hccc did not

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have jurisdiction over them and so they

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took them to the supreme court and they

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sued them and they won

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now they were right that at the time the

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h triple c did not have jurisdiction

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over them however since that was

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revealed the law has now been changed so

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that the h triple c now does have

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jurisdiction over the avn

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now as this bill was being discussed in

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parliament and it's been discussed three

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times now and it's likely to become law

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in the next couple of weeks

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there were many politicians from both

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sides of politics by the way so this was

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a bipartisan discussion people from both

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sides of politics agreed on one issue

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and that was that the avn has to be

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stopped

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now all of the

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goings on from question time in

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parliament are transcribed and stored on

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a document called hansard so of course

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anyone can go and read what these

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members of parliament had to say about

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the avn

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i think you'll agree once i've read you

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some of these quotes that time is up for

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the avn with people tolerating their

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nonsense they're misinformation they're

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scaremongering and they're pretending to

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be a choice network instead of being

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honest about their agenda so first i'm

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going to play you an excerpt from

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anthony roberts who is the minister for

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fair trading in new south wales who is

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the one that will be taking the avn to

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court in june challenging them to change

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their name here's what he had to say in

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parliament on thursday

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madam speaker i thank the honourable

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member

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for his question and certainly applaud

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his determination to ensure that the

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people of new south wales are not misled

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by false claims emanating from fringe

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groups such as the australian

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vaccination network incorporated

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as members of this house would know the

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australian vaccination network or avn

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actively advocates against the use of

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vaccinations and denies that

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immunisation is responsible for the

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dramatic reduction in many serious

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diseases in the past century

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they do this despite overwhelming

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evidence that vaccination is a safe

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effective and rigorously studied

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practice that provides people with a

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high level of protection against

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numerous dangerous diseases including

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several that can be fatal

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madam speaker

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it is incredibly irresponsible for an

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avowedly anti-vaccination group to

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advertise itself as a balanced source of

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information on vaccination

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such an action is not only misleading to

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the public but dangerous for those who

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believe that they are referring to

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evidence-based medical advice

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this danger is highlighted further by

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recent comments from the head of this

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group are mr greg beatty who stated

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don't trust your gp

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the abn does not provide comprehensive

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or credible information on vaccinations

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nor does it offer a balanced view on

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immunisation

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madam speaker the government the medical

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community and the australian medical

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association led by associate professor

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brian alla are in agreement that the

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name australian vaccination network is

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unacceptable

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to address this issue with the public

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interest the farrell stoner government

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introduced the association's

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incorporation amendment unacceptable

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names regulation 2012 in december of

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last year

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this amendment expanded the

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classifications of unacceptable names to

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include any name that is likely to

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mislead the public in relation to the

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nature

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objects or functions of an association

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following the commencement of this

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amendment fair trading issued adm a

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direction to change the name of its

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association on the 14th of january of

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this year

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this was done on the basis that the name

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was undesirable as it had the potential

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to cause confusion mislead the public

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and was against most importantly the

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public interest

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the review found that the avn does not

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provide a balanced view of the processes

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benefits and risks involved with

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immunisation and that its views are

286
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anti-vaccination and it advises against

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being vaccinated or taking part in

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immunisation programs

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the review went on to comment that when

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issues have two sides if the avn takes

291
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just one of them

292
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the association then madam speaker put

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forward some alternative names on the

294
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8th of march and fair trading correctly

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00:11:43,350 --> 00:11:42,000
responded to the association on the 12th

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of march

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i in this house i believe in this

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00:11:49,269 --> 00:11:47,040
government of the opinion that these

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names don't accurately reflect the two

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true nature objects or functions of the

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association

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00:11:57,509 --> 00:11:56,320
lodged an appeal of the name change

303
00:11:59,350 --> 00:11:57,519
direction in the administrative

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decisions tribunal

305
00:12:03,670 --> 00:12:01,600
at the last hearing on the 22nd of march

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this year the president of the tribunal

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00:12:07,190 --> 00:12:05,760
placed conditions on the organisation

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including that a prominent consumer

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00:12:10,710 --> 00:12:08,320
warning be published on the

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association's website and its facebook

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00:12:15,430 --> 00:12:13,360
page by the 26th of march of this year

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this warning states that fair training

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00:12:19,590 --> 00:12:17,440
has directed the association to change

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its name because it regards the name to

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00:12:23,030 --> 00:12:21,680
be misleading and that this direction is

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currently being challenged by the

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tribunal

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madam speaker this warning will help

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reduce the chance of consumers being

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misled while the tribunal proceedings

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are still to be finalized i can inform

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00:12:35,910 --> 00:12:34,079
the house this matter is currently

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00:12:38,470 --> 00:12:35,920
listed for hearing on the 13th and 14th

324
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of june of this year

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madam speaker

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00:12:44,389 --> 00:12:41,839
the liberals and nationals are

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determined to safeguard public health

328
00:12:48,389 --> 00:12:46,800
and we've acted decisively to do so

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madam speaker the recent passage of the

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00:12:53,750 --> 00:12:51,200
health legislation member bill 2013 and

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which i can proudly say was supported by

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00:12:58,389 --> 00:12:55,680
both sides of this house

333
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is only further evidence of the action

334
00:13:01,990 --> 00:13:00,720
we are taking in this space and two

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particular members of this house i'd

336
00:13:05,350 --> 00:13:03,600
like to pay tribute to one is the

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minister for health one is the shadow

338
00:13:09,430 --> 00:13:07,680
minister for health for their strong

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00:13:12,629 --> 00:13:09,440
work in this area they've come together

340
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:12,639
united in this common cause

341
00:13:16,629 --> 00:13:14,240
madam speaker

342
00:13:18,949 --> 00:13:16,639
the people of new south wales can rest

343
00:13:21,350 --> 00:13:18,959
assured that the government indeed this

344
00:13:23,190 --> 00:13:21,360
house is standing firm on its commitment

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to protect our community

346
00:13:27,269 --> 00:13:25,200
and i thank all members in this place

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00:13:28,710 --> 00:13:27,279
for their continued support as we tackle

348
00:13:30,550 --> 00:13:28,720
this issue

349
00:13:33,509 --> 00:13:30,560
let me on behalf of this house put the

350
00:13:35,110 --> 00:13:33,519
avn on novice

351
00:13:37,509 --> 00:13:35,120
this is from the honourable catherine

352
00:13:39,590 --> 00:13:37,519
cusack i call on the healthcare

353
00:13:42,069 --> 00:13:39,600
complaints commission immediately to

354
00:13:44,629 --> 00:13:42,079
stop the australian vaccination network

355
00:13:46,710 --> 00:13:44,639
spreading misleading information and i

356
00:13:48,629 --> 00:13:46,720
ask the media as a whole not to

357
00:13:51,030 --> 00:13:48,639
facilitate the dissemination of such

358
00:13:53,190 --> 00:13:51,040
dangerous messages to vulnerable parents

359
00:13:55,990 --> 00:13:53,200
who are already bombarded with confusing

360
00:13:57,990 --> 00:13:56,000
information and who somehow believe that

361
00:14:01,189 --> 00:13:58,000
the network's role in the immunization

362
00:14:04,310 --> 00:14:01,199
debate is evenly balanced it is not

363
00:14:06,150 --> 00:14:04,320
next up was the honorable trevor khan

364
00:14:07,750 --> 00:14:06,160
i note that at least in part the

365
00:14:10,710 --> 00:14:07,760
amendments to the health care complaints

366
00:14:14,550 --> 00:14:10,720
commission act 1993 arose out of the

367
00:14:17,670 --> 00:14:14,560
hccc investigation into the avn in 2009

368
00:14:20,550 --> 00:14:17,680
and 2010. i am sure a number of members

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00:14:22,949 --> 00:14:20,560
of this place indeed i suspect all have

370
00:14:24,790 --> 00:14:22,959
received various emails from persons who

371
00:14:27,269 --> 00:14:24,800
seek to advance the interests of the

372
00:14:29,509 --> 00:14:27,279
australian vaccination network

373
00:14:32,150 --> 00:14:29,519
in the background we hear boo

374
00:14:34,389 --> 00:14:32,160
the honourable dr peter phelps says i

375
00:14:35,750 --> 00:14:34,399
think insane is the word you are looking

376
00:14:38,790 --> 00:14:35,760
for

377
00:14:41,189 --> 00:14:38,800
the honorable trevor khan continues

378
00:14:42,949 --> 00:14:41,199
let us be plain about this we know that

379
00:14:44,790 --> 00:14:42,959
they disseminated material into the

380
00:14:46,430 --> 00:14:44,800
community that discourages parents from

381
00:14:48,870 --> 00:14:46,440
vaccinating their children

382
00:14:51,590 --> 00:14:48,880
anti-immunisation groups such as the avn

383
00:14:53,110 --> 00:14:51,600
have touted unscientific propaganda such

384
00:14:55,269 --> 00:14:53,120
as the discredited link between the

385
00:14:57,189 --> 00:14:55,279
measles vaccine and autism

386
00:14:58,790 --> 00:14:57,199
the australian vaccination network name

387
00:15:01,110 --> 00:14:58,800
is misleading it implies that it

388
00:15:02,949 --> 00:15:01,120
supports immunisation

389
00:15:04,629 --> 00:15:02,959
the commissioner for fair trading at the

390
00:15:06,310 --> 00:15:04,639
encouragement of the minister has issued

391
00:15:08,870 --> 00:15:06,320
a direction under the association's

392
00:15:11,189 --> 00:15:08,880
incorporation act for the avn to change

393
00:15:13,189 --> 00:15:11,199
its unacceptable misleading and

394
00:15:15,509 --> 00:15:13,199
deceptive name

395
00:15:17,509 --> 00:15:15,519
i congratulate him on having the guts to

396
00:15:19,590 --> 00:15:17,519
stand up against an organization such as

397
00:15:21,670 --> 00:15:19,600
the avn i invite members of the

398
00:15:23,590 --> 00:15:21,680
community to send emails about my speech

399
00:15:25,910 --> 00:15:23,600
i will happily receive them and respond

400
00:15:28,389 --> 00:15:25,920
accordingly this comment is in reference

401
00:15:31,110 --> 00:15:28,399
to dr andrew mcdonald he's also a member

402
00:15:33,269 --> 00:15:31,120
of parliament who commented in the hand

403
00:15:35,030 --> 00:15:33,279
side several weeks ago that he's had to

404
00:15:37,030 --> 00:15:35,040
call police several times because of the

405
00:15:38,710 --> 00:15:37,040
threatening emails he's received from

406
00:15:41,110 --> 00:15:38,720
supporters of the anti-vaccination

407
00:15:42,790 --> 00:15:41,120
movement in australia

408
00:15:44,790 --> 00:15:42,800
based on the speeches that were made a

409
00:15:47,030 --> 00:15:44,800
couple of weeks ago in parliament many

410
00:15:48,069 --> 00:15:47,040
of these politicians also received

411
00:15:49,829 --> 00:15:48,079
emails

412
00:15:51,829 --> 00:15:49,839
in support of the anti-vaccination

413
00:15:53,990 --> 00:15:51,839
network so here the honorable trevor

414
00:15:56,790 --> 00:15:54,000
khan is saying send your emails i don't

415
00:15:58,870 --> 00:15:56,800
care i'm not going to change my position

416
00:16:00,790 --> 00:15:58,880
and then we have dr john kane who says

417
00:16:02,710 --> 00:16:00,800
amongst other things i believe that

418
00:16:04,710 --> 00:16:02,720
people such as merrill dory from

419
00:16:07,430 --> 00:16:04,720
australian vaccination network are

420
00:16:09,030 --> 00:16:07,440
behaving in an entirely immoral way to

421
00:16:10,870 --> 00:16:09,040
which a comment comes from the back of

422
00:16:13,910 --> 00:16:10,880
the room saying you will be getting

423
00:16:16,310 --> 00:16:13,920
emails now to john to which he replies i

424
00:16:17,829 --> 00:16:16,320
have plenty of emails believe me my

425
00:16:19,829 --> 00:16:17,839
facebook site became a great

426
00:16:21,430 --> 00:16:19,839
battleground between rationality and

427
00:16:23,829 --> 00:16:21,440
irrationality

428
00:16:26,550 --> 00:16:23,839
good on you says the honorable trevor

429
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:26,560
khan and it continues and it continues

430
00:16:31,110 --> 00:16:28,320
and it continues and there are pages and

431
00:16:33,910 --> 00:16:31,120
pages and pages of mps standing up

432
00:16:35,509 --> 00:16:33,920
condemning the avn in parliament and

433
00:16:37,110 --> 00:16:35,519
calling for the healthcare complaints

434
00:16:39,430 --> 00:16:37,120
commission and the department of fair

435
00:16:41,189 --> 00:16:39,440
trading to shut them down

436
00:16:43,430 --> 00:16:41,199
and in the speech that i played earlier

437
00:16:45,430 --> 00:16:43,440
from anthony roberts who is the minister

438
00:16:49,189 --> 00:16:45,440
for fair trading you'll notice that he

439
00:16:51,990 --> 00:16:49,199
said at the end i put the avn on notice

440
00:16:53,910 --> 00:16:52,000
time is almost up for the avn

441
00:16:55,910 --> 00:16:53,920
there is going to be now once this

442
00:16:58,230 --> 00:16:55,920
legislation comes through fresh

443
00:17:01,269 --> 00:16:58,240
investigations into the information they

444
00:17:03,189 --> 00:17:01,279
disseminate and importantly the change

445
00:17:05,429 --> 00:17:03,199
in this in in this legislation came

446
00:17:06,470 --> 00:17:05,439
about because meryl dory sued the

447
00:17:09,029 --> 00:17:06,480
government

448
00:17:10,949 --> 00:17:09,039
so this is your fault meryl

449
00:17:13,429 --> 00:17:10,959
this legislation will not just affect

450
00:17:15,669 --> 00:17:13,439
the avn it will affect every

451
00:17:17,909 --> 00:17:15,679
alternative medicine practitioner who

452
00:17:19,510 --> 00:17:17,919
makes claims that are likely to affect

453
00:17:21,750 --> 00:17:19,520
somebody's well-being

454
00:17:24,230 --> 00:17:21,760
so in the past you used to have to

455
00:17:26,549 --> 00:17:24,240
demonstrate that you had been harmed by

456
00:17:28,950 --> 00:17:26,559
a practitioner's advice or their

457
00:17:30,789 --> 00:17:28,960
treatment now you just have to

458
00:17:33,430 --> 00:17:30,799
demonstrate it's likely it could cause

459
00:17:35,430 --> 00:17:33,440
you harm and in addition to that the

460
00:17:37,750 --> 00:17:35,440
government itself can instigate

461
00:17:39,909 --> 00:17:37,760
complaints or action against

462
00:17:42,710 --> 00:17:39,919
practitioners if they believe they can

463
00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:42,720
also potentially cause harm

464
00:17:46,549 --> 00:17:44,720
so as a result of this

465
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:46,559
and as a result of the week-long

466
00:17:50,710 --> 00:17:48,880
campaign which ends tonight by the daily

467
00:17:53,190 --> 00:17:50,720
telegraph the murdoch press the

468
00:17:54,390 --> 00:17:53,200
anti-vaxxers are screeching like

469
00:17:56,950 --> 00:17:54,400
banshees

470
00:17:58,789 --> 00:17:56,960
i just want to point out that they

471
00:18:00,150 --> 00:17:58,799
brought this on themselves they

472
00:18:02,470 --> 00:18:00,160
definitely brought the legislation

473
00:18:04,070 --> 00:18:02,480
change on themselves and this week-long

474
00:18:06,549 --> 00:18:04,080
campaign that was instigated by the

475
00:18:08,630 --> 00:18:06,559
daily telegraph murdoch press they also

476
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:08,640
brought this idea of no jab no play on

477
00:18:14,390 --> 00:18:11,760
themselves because in areas where

478
00:18:16,870 --> 00:18:14,400
the heartland of the avn lies there is

479
00:18:19,190 --> 00:18:16,880
levels of something like just 46 of

480
00:18:20,950 --> 00:18:19,200
children are completely vaccinated

481
00:18:23,190 --> 00:18:20,960
so there is outbreaks of disease in

482
00:18:25,590 --> 00:18:23,200
those areas that has prompted the

483
00:18:28,549 --> 00:18:25,600
community to say we have to put a stop

484
00:18:31,270 --> 00:18:28,559
to this so in essence the anti-vaxxers

485
00:18:33,350 --> 00:18:31,280
are their own worst enemy

486
00:18:40,830 --> 00:18:33,360
and until next time this has been dr

487
00:18:45,990 --> 00:18:43,590
reports now on belfast fm we turn to the

488
00:18:48,070 --> 00:18:46,000
personal ads easing going and confident

489
00:18:50,710 --> 00:18:48,080
skeptic seeks other critical thinkers

490
00:18:52,710 --> 00:18:50,720
for fun laughter and good times must be

491
00:18:54,789 --> 00:18:52,720
willing to apply logic liberally and a

492
00:18:56,870 --> 00:18:54,799
good listener expect something new and

493
00:18:58,870 --> 00:18:56,880
interesting every month come and meet me

494
00:19:00,950 --> 00:18:58,880
in belfast in northern ireland if this

495
00:19:03,430 --> 00:19:00,960
sounds like you check out my profile on

496
00:19:08,310 --> 00:19:03,440
belfastskeptics.com

497
00:19:13,990 --> 00:19:11,590
welcome to a week in science from rios

498
00:19:17,190 --> 00:19:14,000
this week the brains of psychopaths and

499
00:19:24,310 --> 00:19:17,200
gigglers greener iron extraction and

500
00:19:28,870 --> 00:19:26,470
two brainy stories came out this week

501
00:19:31,830 --> 00:19:28,880
predicting psychopaths and analyzing

502
00:19:33,990 --> 00:19:31,840
laughter uk neuroscientists think they

503
00:19:36,150 --> 00:19:34,000
can detect early signs of adult

504
00:19:38,470 --> 00:19:36,160
psychopaths in the brains of children

505
00:19:40,630 --> 00:19:38,480
with behavioral problems these

506
00:19:42,870 --> 00:19:40,640
children's brains react differently to

507
00:19:44,310 --> 00:19:42,880
most people when they see images of

508
00:19:46,870 --> 00:19:44,320
others in pain

509
00:19:48,870 --> 00:19:46,880
meanwhile a german analysis of laughter

510
00:19:51,510 --> 00:19:48,880
found that tickling laughs do not light

511
00:19:54,070 --> 00:19:51,520
up the same areas of the brain as joyous

512
00:19:56,470 --> 00:19:54,080
or taunting laughter but a tickle does

513
00:19:58,950 --> 00:19:56,480
trigger a more complex pattern of brain

514
00:20:00,549 --> 00:19:58,960
activity the three types of laughter are

515
00:20:03,270 --> 00:20:00,559
associated with different social

516
00:20:07,110 --> 00:20:03,280
contexts and are a complex type of

517
00:20:09,190 --> 00:20:07,120
non-verbal communication

518
00:20:11,750 --> 00:20:09,200
u.s researchers have developed an

519
00:20:14,789 --> 00:20:11,760
improved greener method for extracting

520
00:20:17,190 --> 00:20:14,799
iron from iron ore an electrical current

521
00:20:19,510 --> 00:20:17,200
is passed through molten iron ore via

522
00:20:22,310 --> 00:20:19,520
electrodes resulting in the separation

523
00:20:24,870 --> 00:20:22,320
of oxygen from iron at the anode or

524
00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:24,880
negative end the new method uses a

525
00:20:29,350 --> 00:20:27,360
chromium-based anode which can withstand

526
00:20:31,430 --> 00:20:29,360
the high temperatures and corrosive

527
00:20:33,909 --> 00:20:31,440
conditions experienced during this

528
00:20:36,149 --> 00:20:33,919
process this is a more efficient method

529
00:20:38,710 --> 00:20:36,159
of extracting iron that also generates

530
00:20:41,350 --> 00:20:38,720
significantly less carbon dioxide than

531
00:20:44,470 --> 00:20:41,360
traditional techniques and now four

532
00:20:46,789 --> 00:20:44,480
science headlines in 30 seconds a dna

533
00:20:48,470 --> 00:20:46,799
study reveals that all europeans are

534
00:20:50,549 --> 00:20:48,480
very closely related

535
00:20:53,110 --> 00:20:50,559
such that a person from the uk and a

536
00:20:55,830 --> 00:20:53,120
person from turkey are likely to share

537
00:20:58,470 --> 00:20:55,840
all the same ancestors around 1 000

538
00:21:00,470 --> 00:20:58,480
years ago a dose of flu for mum during

539
00:21:03,190 --> 00:21:00,480
pregnancy may increase the risk of

540
00:21:05,590 --> 00:21:03,200
bipolar offspring new evidence suggests

541
00:21:07,430 --> 00:21:05,600
that climate change not people drove

542
00:21:09,669 --> 00:21:07,440
australia's giant marsupials to

543
00:21:11,669 --> 00:21:09,679
extinction and science supports our

544
00:21:13,750 --> 00:21:11,679
intuition that you shouldn't shop when

545
00:21:15,990 --> 00:21:13,760
hungry because you'll pick higher

546
00:21:18,470 --> 00:21:16,000
calorie foods

547
00:21:20,789 --> 00:21:18,480
and finally this week german researchers

548
00:21:23,830 --> 00:21:20,799
test how much of our personality is in

549
00:21:26,390 --> 00:21:23,840
our genes and how much of it is learned

550
00:21:27,990 --> 00:21:26,400
they raised identical twin mice in two

551
00:21:30,870 --> 00:21:28,000
different environments and found that

552
00:21:32,710 --> 00:21:30,880
they developed different personalities a

553
00:21:34,710 --> 00:21:32,720
closer look at their brains revealed

554
00:21:36,310 --> 00:21:34,720
that their neurons developed differently

555
00:21:38,710 --> 00:21:36,320
when they were exposed to varying

556
00:21:41,270 --> 00:21:38,720
environments and stimuli this helps us

557
00:21:43,510 --> 00:21:41,280
better understand nature versus nurture

558
00:21:46,470 --> 00:21:43,520
and the impact of life experiences on

559
00:21:48,390 --> 00:21:46,480
our personalities

560
00:21:50,549 --> 00:21:48,400
if you're hungry for more great science

561
00:21:52,950 --> 00:21:50,559
content why not check out the blogs on

562
00:21:55,350 --> 00:21:52,960
our website this week i looked at a

563
00:21:57,990 --> 00:21:55,360
threat to peer review while other blogs

564
00:21:59,990 --> 00:21:58,000
offer a peek at our new play the clock

565
00:22:02,870 --> 00:22:00,000
and reveal the science behind autumn

566
00:22:05,110 --> 00:22:02,880
leaves you'll find our blogs under news

567
00:22:06,630 --> 00:22:05,120
on the rio's website that's been the

568
00:22:08,710 --> 00:22:06,640
highlights of another big week in

569
00:22:12,669 --> 00:22:08,720
science for more information and other

570
00:22:15,590 --> 00:22:12,679
science news check out the rio's website

571
00:22:17,350 --> 00:22:15,600
riaus.org dot a u where you can also

572
00:22:19,510 --> 00:22:17,360
sign up for notification of future

573
00:22:22,710 --> 00:22:19,520
episodes you can follow the conversation

574
00:22:24,390 --> 00:22:22,720
on twitter using the hashtag weekinsigh

575
00:22:35,830 --> 00:22:24,400
i'm paul willis and on behalf of the

576
00:22:39,669 --> 00:22:38,070
hi i'm finn and i'm rebecca and we're

577
00:22:41,669 --> 00:22:39,679
the skippercons

578
00:22:43,110 --> 00:22:41,679
cons is an irish podcast by the dublin

579
00:22:44,789 --> 00:22:43,120
skeptic society it takes a

580
00:22:46,549 --> 00:22:44,799
conversational reverent look at science

581
00:22:48,149 --> 00:22:46,559
news and skeptical topics from an irish

582
00:23:00,630 --> 00:22:48,159
perspective you can find us at

583
00:23:18,390 --> 00:23:04,710
here's maynard's spooky action

584
00:23:22,789 --> 00:23:20,390
you guys are definitely behind science

585
00:23:24,710 --> 00:23:22,799
science is real it's a fantastic song i

586
00:23:26,549 --> 00:23:24,720
mean oh thank you oh look and part and

587
00:23:29,270 --> 00:23:26,559
look i love it from the big bang to the

588
00:23:30,950 --> 00:23:29,280
dna and uh that whole album and it was a

589
00:23:32,630 --> 00:23:30,960
children's album as well so kids could

590
00:23:35,270 --> 00:23:32,640
get into science was this partially

591
00:23:38,149 --> 00:23:35,280
reaction to you not you know all the

592
00:23:39,909 --> 00:23:38,159
pseudoscience that's around or not

593
00:23:41,909 --> 00:23:39,919
well i think you know i'm not really

594
00:23:44,230 --> 00:23:41,919
sure i don't know much about australian

595
00:23:46,070 --> 00:23:44,240
culture but there's this um

596
00:23:48,310 --> 00:23:46,080
there's a lot of um

597
00:23:52,149 --> 00:23:48,320
very dull dull

598
00:23:55,590 --> 00:23:52,159
witted uh anti-science uh sentiment in

599
00:23:56,950 --> 00:23:55,600
the united states um including like uh

600
00:23:59,669 --> 00:23:56,960
a um

601
00:24:01,909 --> 00:23:59,679
a movement to teach uh i believe the

602
00:24:05,669 --> 00:24:01,919
expression is teach the controversy

603
00:24:08,710 --> 00:24:05,679
which is to say sort of dismantle

604
00:24:10,710 --> 00:24:08,720
uh regular science education

605
00:24:12,549 --> 00:24:10,720
and turn it into

606
00:24:13,909 --> 00:24:12,559
this sort of open-ended

607
00:24:16,390 --> 00:24:13,919
unknowable

608
00:24:21,669 --> 00:24:16,400
lists of superstitions and you know fake

609
00:24:27,190 --> 00:24:24,149
you know a lot of the ideas of of

610
00:24:30,149 --> 00:24:27,200
science are not uh controversial you can

611
00:24:31,750 --> 00:24:30,159
understand that when you fly in a plane

612
00:24:34,789 --> 00:24:31,760
you know you understand that when you

613
00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:34,799
when you talk on a telephone uh like uh

614
00:24:38,390 --> 00:24:36,640
you can understand that when

615
00:24:39,990 --> 00:24:38,400
there's radioactivity you know like

616
00:24:43,110 --> 00:24:40,000
science science is

617
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:43,120
something that is it's a very reasonable

618
00:24:48,630 --> 00:24:44,320
pursuit

619
00:24:50,710 --> 00:24:48,640
it's not based on superstition and uh

620
00:24:52,149 --> 00:24:50,720
it's important that people

621
00:24:53,510 --> 00:24:52,159
not just uh

622
00:24:56,470 --> 00:24:53,520
let their

623
00:24:58,470 --> 00:24:56,480
but their imaginations get get ahead of

624
00:25:00,310 --> 00:24:58,480
them look at john flansberg you did

625
00:25:02,710 --> 00:25:00,320
actually make a small mistake when you

626
00:25:05,110 --> 00:25:02,720
were doing the the science album i think

627
00:25:06,710 --> 00:25:05,120
it was a relation into the the sun you

628
00:25:08,390 --> 00:25:06,720
said the sun's a ball of gas and it

629
00:25:09,830 --> 00:25:08,400
turns out that it's plasma was that the

630
00:25:13,110 --> 00:25:09,840
most slight mistake

631
00:25:15,430 --> 00:25:13,120
we've uh we very uh notoriously covered

632
00:25:17,590 --> 00:25:15,440
a song that was written in the 60s that

633
00:25:20,230 --> 00:25:17,600
uh was on an album that john and i both

634
00:25:21,990 --> 00:25:20,240
heard of children uh called science

635
00:25:24,149 --> 00:25:22,000
songs which was recorded by a fellow

636
00:25:26,070 --> 00:25:24,159
named tom glazer and he recorded a song

637
00:25:27,669 --> 00:25:26,080
called why why does the sun shine

638
00:25:30,950 --> 00:25:27,679
parentheses the sun is ambassador

639
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:30,960
incandescent gas and um the song was

640
00:25:35,269 --> 00:25:32,880
written by tom glaser and hai zarat and

641
00:25:36,630 --> 00:25:35,279
basically it's an irish folk melody it's

642
00:25:39,269 --> 00:25:36,640
a passage from the golden book

643
00:25:41,510 --> 00:25:39,279
encyclopedia put to an irish folk melody

644
00:25:43,590 --> 00:25:41,520
and it's kind of a curious

645
00:25:45,830 --> 00:25:43,600
hybrid of a song because it has a very

646
00:25:48,710 --> 00:25:45,840
strange cadence it doesn't the words

647
00:25:50,870 --> 00:25:48,720
don't rhyme and and the meter is very uh

648
00:25:52,149 --> 00:25:50,880
kind of herky jerky as you can imagine

649
00:25:53,870 --> 00:25:52,159
just applying

650
00:25:57,029 --> 00:25:53,880
uh you know a passage of the

651
00:25:59,950 --> 00:25:57,039
encyclopedia to uh a song

652
00:26:03,750 --> 00:25:59,960
to a tune it was the best science of

653
00:26:05,510 --> 00:26:03,760
1965 i would imagine but it emerges that

654
00:26:07,110 --> 00:26:05,520
you know since then

655
00:26:08,870 --> 00:26:07,120
we were actually it was the one thing on

656
00:26:10,390 --> 00:26:08,880
the album that we didn't run by our

657
00:26:11,909 --> 00:26:10,400
science consultant

658
00:26:15,269 --> 00:26:11,919
because we were actually

659
00:26:17,190 --> 00:26:15,279
because it was from another source we

660
00:26:19,190 --> 00:26:17,200
assumed that the facts were straight it

661
00:26:21,190 --> 00:26:19,200
seems like a very reasonable song but

662
00:26:23,029 --> 00:26:21,200
basically science

663
00:26:24,870 --> 00:26:23,039
the you know the best understanding of

664
00:26:27,669 --> 00:26:24,880
the sun now

665
00:26:30,470 --> 00:26:27,679
is uh is that the uh the sun is

666
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:30,480
essentially plasma you know i i'm not a

667
00:26:34,950 --> 00:26:32,720
scientist and i'm i'm already kind of

668
00:26:36,470 --> 00:26:34,960
like over my head trying to explain the

669
00:26:38,149 --> 00:26:36,480
difference but um

670
00:26:40,950 --> 00:26:38,159
it's not a it's not a massive

671
00:26:43,510 --> 00:26:40,960
incandescent cast

672
00:26:45,510 --> 00:26:43,520
and the new ob the new album is nanobots

673
00:26:47,830 --> 00:26:45,520
and look it's great to have you in the

674
00:26:49,350 --> 00:26:47,840
country again after 12 years um have you

675
00:26:51,029 --> 00:26:49,360
a lot of people just come running up to

676
00:26:52,630 --> 00:26:51,039
you going thank you for coming back

677
00:26:54,149 --> 00:26:52,640
because where have you been

678
00:26:56,870 --> 00:26:54,159
for a long time

679
00:26:58,549 --> 00:26:56,880
uh we we were getting a lot of sort of

680
00:27:01,029 --> 00:26:58,559
negative reports you know

681
00:27:03,190 --> 00:27:01,039
rock promoters are not by by temperament

682
00:27:06,310 --> 00:27:03,200
the most optimistic bunch

683
00:27:08,230 --> 00:27:06,320
we always felt like we had a very solid

684
00:27:10,630 --> 00:27:08,240
audience in in australia we'd always

685
00:27:12,950 --> 00:27:10,640
done done you know pretty solid business

686
00:27:14,870 --> 00:27:12,960
and and i think we always felt like

687
00:27:17,350 --> 00:27:14,880
there's something about australian

688
00:27:18,789 --> 00:27:17,360
audiences that actually um really runs

689
00:27:21,350 --> 00:27:18,799
parallel to the spirit of what we're

690
00:27:22,149 --> 00:27:21,360
doing which is that you know although we

691
00:27:23,750 --> 00:27:22,159
are

692
00:27:25,669 --> 00:27:23,760
deeply invested in what we're doing and

693
00:27:27,669 --> 00:27:25,679
very passionate about what we're doing

694
00:27:29,830 --> 00:27:27,679
we also don't take ourselves completely

695
00:27:32,230 --> 00:27:29,840
seriously and i think that that is a a

696
00:27:34,710 --> 00:27:32,240
balancing act that that you know it's

697
00:27:37,830 --> 00:27:34,720
important that we succeed in kind of

698
00:27:39,190 --> 00:27:37,840
tempering the the the more lighthearted

699
00:27:41,750 --> 00:27:39,200
parts of what we do

700
00:27:44,470 --> 00:27:41,760
with like solid melodies and good

701
00:27:45,909 --> 00:27:44,480
songwriting and and obviously we're you

702
00:27:47,110 --> 00:27:45,919
know compared to a lot of other rock

703
00:27:49,669 --> 00:27:47,120
bands we're very

704
00:27:51,350 --> 00:27:49,679
upbeat but it's not just uh it's not

705
00:27:53,190 --> 00:27:51,360
just for laughs i guess it's the thing

706
00:27:55,029 --> 00:27:53,200
like there's a there's no emotional

707
00:27:56,230 --> 00:27:55,039
content so what we're doing i i think

708
00:27:58,630 --> 00:27:56,240
there's something in the australian

709
00:28:00,630 --> 00:27:58,640
psyche that we don't take many things

710
00:28:02,470 --> 00:28:00,640
seriously but at the same time we

711
00:28:04,310 --> 00:28:02,480
appreciate artistry and i think that's

712
00:28:06,710 --> 00:28:04,320
where you guys fit into it

713
00:28:08,950 --> 00:28:06,720
yeah i mean i feel like i feel like um

714
00:28:11,110 --> 00:28:08,960
uh there's sort of a kindred spirit nate

715
00:28:13,269 --> 00:28:11,120
between they might be jonathan australia

716
00:28:14,630 --> 00:28:13,279
that is is actually quite rare i mean we

717
00:28:16,630 --> 00:28:14,640
might actually

718
00:28:18,149 --> 00:28:16,640
you know we might fare better here

719
00:28:21,990 --> 00:28:18,159
professionally than

720
00:28:23,590 --> 00:28:22,000
in in a lot of other territories

721
00:28:25,269 --> 00:28:23,600
is there a problem somewhere where go oh

722
00:28:26,710 --> 00:28:25,279
that they just do those funny novelty

723
00:28:29,510 --> 00:28:26,720
songs do you get like written off like

724
00:28:31,190 --> 00:28:29,520
that sometimes uh you know well you know

725
00:28:33,110 --> 00:28:31,200
what's interesting is that you know you

726
00:28:35,590 --> 00:28:33,120
know we've been doing this for 30 years

727
00:28:37,110 --> 00:28:35,600
and and when we first started when we

728
00:28:39,750 --> 00:28:37,120
were basically

729
00:28:40,950 --> 00:28:39,760
uh seen as essentially like an art

730
00:28:42,950 --> 00:28:40,960
project

731
00:28:44,389 --> 00:28:42,960
we had tremendous success

732
00:28:46,710 --> 00:28:44,399
in germany

733
00:28:49,430 --> 00:28:46,720
where i think we were perceived we were

734
00:28:51,990 --> 00:28:49,440
perceived as bohemians very much in the

735
00:28:53,830 --> 00:28:52,000
tradition of like frank zappa who is

736
00:28:55,990 --> 00:28:53,840
held in very high regard there and

737
00:28:59,830 --> 00:28:56,000
there's and there's a lot of um

738
00:29:01,750 --> 00:28:59,840
the way rock music is is consumed by the

739
00:29:04,389 --> 00:29:01,760
counter culture there is highly

740
00:29:06,149 --> 00:29:04,399
politicized oh and then they enjoy the

741
00:29:07,510 --> 00:29:06,159
tinkering like you georgio marota and

742
00:29:09,430 --> 00:29:07,520
your craft work

743
00:29:11,350 --> 00:29:09,440
you know just because you stand apart

744
00:29:13,190 --> 00:29:11,360
from the mainstream culture doesn't mean

745
00:29:14,950 --> 00:29:13,200
you stand against the mainstream culture

746
00:29:17,269 --> 00:29:14,960
i don't think like we're i think we're

747
00:29:18,710 --> 00:29:17,279
that concerned with

748
00:29:20,950 --> 00:29:18,720
we're you know we're not like shaking

749
00:29:23,750 --> 00:29:20,960
our fists at the radio going like how

750
00:29:24,789 --> 00:29:23,760
how can this stand you know

751
00:29:26,789 --> 00:29:24,799
um

752
00:29:28,950 --> 00:29:26,799
uh you know we like a lot of different

753
00:29:31,029 --> 00:29:28,960
kinds of music and and

754
00:29:32,630 --> 00:29:31,039
uh we listen to we listen to what we

755
00:29:33,830 --> 00:29:32,640
like to listen to you know so it's it's

756
00:29:36,389 --> 00:29:33,840
um

757
00:29:38,630 --> 00:29:36,399
it's not it's not it's not a culture war

758
00:29:40,870 --> 00:29:38,640
for us and i think i think in the world

759
00:29:42,470 --> 00:29:40,880
of rock criticism it's very hard for

760
00:29:44,310 --> 00:29:42,480
people

761
00:29:46,870 --> 00:29:44,320
i think it's i think it's difficult you

762
00:29:48,870 --> 00:29:46,880
know in a in a hot sort of a

763
00:29:51,750 --> 00:29:48,880
hot house environment of

764
00:29:53,110 --> 00:29:51,760
a lot criticism to not start thinking of

765
00:29:54,710 --> 00:29:53,120
bands as kind of

766
00:29:56,230 --> 00:29:54,720
pitting themselves against one another

767
00:29:57,990 --> 00:29:56,240
that they're somehow in competition for

768
00:29:59,830 --> 00:29:58,000
one against one another and i think

769
00:30:01,350 --> 00:29:59,840
nothing is really further from the case

770
00:30:04,630 --> 00:30:01,360
for us but what's interesting is that

771
00:30:07,510 --> 00:30:04,640
when we started we were very much seen

772
00:30:10,230 --> 00:30:07,520
as sort of wary culture warriors against

773
00:30:13,430 --> 00:30:10,240
the mainstream in germany and then over

774
00:30:15,750 --> 00:30:13,440
time especially as we became more

775
00:30:18,789 --> 00:30:15,760
commercially viable as an international

776
00:30:20,710 --> 00:30:18,799
act i think it was very hard for them to

777
00:30:22,149 --> 00:30:20,720
uh understand this and take it to face

778
00:30:23,830 --> 00:30:22,159
value i think it was sort of like i

779
00:30:25,430 --> 00:30:23,840
think they just thought oh these guys

780
00:30:27,590 --> 00:30:25,440
they're just entertainers you know they

781
00:30:29,750 --> 00:30:27,600
we made a mistake and and i know i think

782
00:30:31,430 --> 00:30:29,760
the truth is some is actually something

783
00:30:32,870 --> 00:30:31,440
entirely different i don't think oh i

784
00:30:36,070 --> 00:30:32,880
think they were right in the first place

785
00:30:38,070 --> 00:30:36,080
or or or later i did one of my favorite

786
00:30:39,430 --> 00:30:38,080
albums of yours is apollo 18 there's

787
00:30:41,430 --> 00:30:39,440
something about that album that really

788
00:30:42,950 --> 00:30:41,440
resounded with me and i love the song

789
00:30:44,630 --> 00:30:42,960
turn around probably because it's the

790
00:30:48,950 --> 00:30:44,640
only song i could think of that uses the

791
00:30:54,070 --> 00:30:50,630
my obsequious

792
00:30:57,590 --> 00:30:54,080
so i looked out the window at him

793
00:30:59,590 --> 00:30:57,600
he had the same obsequious manner

794
00:31:01,909 --> 00:30:59,600
that was the reason oh well thank you

795
00:31:04,230 --> 00:31:01,919
very much yeah i'm secret this is a

796
00:31:06,070 --> 00:31:04,240
great word i mean you never hear it i

797
00:31:08,389 --> 00:31:06,080
mean beyonce has never used it once

798
00:31:10,549 --> 00:31:08,399
what's going on there

799
00:31:12,870 --> 00:31:10,559
oh i think you know i don't know i think

800
00:31:14,149 --> 00:31:12,880
i think she's uh she might be tuned in

801
00:31:16,149 --> 00:31:14,159
to uh

802
00:31:17,269 --> 00:31:16,159
secretness i think i think she probably

803
00:31:19,190 --> 00:31:17,279
uh

804
00:31:20,789 --> 00:31:19,200
she's probably tired of it

805
00:31:22,789 --> 00:31:20,799
now look i've got a i've only got a few

806
00:31:24,710 --> 00:31:22,799
minutes here i'll rush a few questions

807
00:31:26,710 --> 00:31:24,720
past you now i'm a big fan of the star

808
00:31:28,630 --> 00:31:26,720
trek pajamas if you were to get the star

809
00:31:32,870 --> 00:31:28,640
trek pajamas would you go for the red

810
00:31:34,389 --> 00:31:32,880
shirt the blue shirt or the gold shirt

811
00:31:35,909 --> 00:31:34,399
um

812
00:31:37,909 --> 00:31:35,919
well unfortunately i think i'd probably

813
00:31:40,549 --> 00:31:37,919
look a little bit too much like william

814
00:31:43,110 --> 00:31:40,559
shatner in any of them um

815
00:31:45,990 --> 00:31:43,120
it's it's sort of an unflattering look

816
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:46,000
for uh for you know bulky guys you gotta

817
00:31:51,669 --> 00:31:48,559
you gotta be uh you gotta be really thin

818
00:31:52,789 --> 00:31:51,679
to to rock uh a turtleneck i think

819
00:31:55,029 --> 00:31:52,799
um

820
00:31:57,029 --> 00:31:55,039
uh but i i guess i'd go with the blue

821
00:31:58,630 --> 00:31:57,039
look john flansberg back in australia

822
00:32:00,389 --> 00:31:58,640
after 12 years with john lennon don't

823
00:32:02,230 --> 00:32:00,399
make it so long next time you've got

824
00:32:04,149 --> 00:32:02,240
sock puppets on so you've got sock

825
00:32:05,509 --> 00:32:04,159
monkeys on stage look the only thing

826
00:32:07,830 --> 00:32:05,519
missing from your show currently i

827
00:32:08,630 --> 00:32:07,840
reckon is a confetti cannon

828
00:32:09,830 --> 00:32:08,640
uh

829
00:32:11,750 --> 00:32:09,840
next time

830
00:32:13,190 --> 00:32:11,760
we'll get it through our customs

831
00:32:16,789 --> 00:32:13,200
thank you john plans thanks for your

832
00:32:18,950 --> 00:32:16,799
time hey thank you hello hello

833
00:32:21,830 --> 00:32:18,960
we are they might be giants and we want

834
00:32:24,149 --> 00:32:21,840
to welcome you to our musical laboratory

835
00:32:26,710 --> 00:32:24,159
as the philosopher rudolf karnip once so

836
00:32:28,870 --> 00:32:26,720
clearly said

837
00:32:31,830 --> 00:32:28,880
science is a system of statements based

838
00:32:34,230 --> 00:32:31,840
on direct experience and controlled by

839
00:32:37,830 --> 00:32:34,240
experimental verification

840
00:32:49,830 --> 00:32:37,840
or as we say science is real

841
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:55,110
to the milky

842
00:33:00,070 --> 00:32:56,710
the way

843
00:33:02,230 --> 00:33:00,080
about angels unicorns and elves now i

844
00:33:05,430 --> 00:33:02,240
like the stories

845
00:33:08,630 --> 00:33:05,440
as much as anybody else but when i'm

846
00:33:18,230 --> 00:33:08,640
seeking knowledge either simple or

847
00:33:44,710 --> 00:33:36,830
is

848
00:33:50,789 --> 00:33:47,909
a scientific theory

849
00:34:03,430 --> 00:33:50,799
isn't just a haunt your guess it's more

850
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:21,550
the truth is

851
00:35:19,430 --> 00:34:23,190
science

852
00:35:23,990 --> 00:35:22,390
hello i'm marit and i'm kristen and we

853
00:35:25,750 --> 00:35:24,000
want to let you know that there are lots

854
00:35:27,670 --> 00:35:25,760
of norwegian skeptics for you to get to

855
00:35:29,510 --> 00:35:27,680
know there are blogs and pubmed and a

856
00:35:31,030 --> 00:35:29,520
podcast and the norwegian skeptics also

857
00:35:33,030 --> 00:35:31,040
do paranormal tests and consumer

858
00:35:52,150 --> 00:35:33,040
activism to find out more google

859
00:35:55,430 --> 00:35:53,750
thank you for listening to the skeptic

860
00:35:57,430 --> 00:35:55,440
zone wow what an interesting episode

861
00:35:59,109 --> 00:35:57,440
that was again

862
00:36:00,390 --> 00:35:59,119
i think you should tell your local

863
00:36:03,030 --> 00:36:00,400
elected

864
00:36:05,510 --> 00:36:03,040
representatives what we're doing here in

865
00:36:07,430 --> 00:36:05,520
new south wales in australia

866
00:36:10,069 --> 00:36:07,440
coming up on next week's show i think

867
00:36:11,589 --> 00:36:10,079
we've got some more interviews from qed

868
00:36:13,270 --> 00:36:11,599
in manchester

869
00:36:15,030 --> 00:36:13,280
probably some more may not in fact

870
00:36:17,190 --> 00:36:15,040
definitely some more made out he sent me

871
00:36:19,030 --> 00:36:17,200
a lot of stuff lately

872
00:36:20,470 --> 00:36:19,040
and who knows maybe my voice will sound

873
00:36:22,310 --> 00:36:20,480
better i don't know

874
00:36:24,790 --> 00:36:22,320
why is my voice it's gone a bit hoarse

875
00:36:28,390 --> 00:36:24,800
folks i don't know why

876
00:36:30,390 --> 00:36:28,400
no clue sometimes it it just doesn't

877
00:36:33,670 --> 00:36:30,400
but for now this is richard saunders off

878
00:36:39,190 --> 00:36:33,680
to gargle some salty water signing off

879
00:36:42,390 --> 00:36:40,870
you've been listening to the skeptic

880
00:36:47,190 --> 00:36:42,400
zone